The Silence Is Deafening

[BajaBravo]

Prime Minister Paul Martin pledged to President Bush that Canada would provide "any and all possible assistance".

People have to keep in mind however that the US has a healthy disaster/emergency infrastructure. Pouring money, people, or relief goods into the area halfhazardly isn't going to do much good. Once the situation stabilizes and it is known exactly what assistance is necessary, there is no doubt in my mind that it will be offered.

It will not be very long before I see Katrina Relief donation opportunities around here, just like any disaster before.

This kind of sentiment is a little frustrating. I remember clearly after 911 the intensive relief efforts being organized here - from fund raising to food and clothing drives to sending thousands of volunteer emergency workers and others to help out, to to mention feeding and housing the thousands and thousands of US citizens caught in the air that day. What do we get for our efforts? More or less accused of turning our backs on you.

Just because Fox News or CNN doesn't emphasize international support efforts doesn't mean they aren't there.

Just an a counterpoint, I admit that the US does a tremendous amount of humanitarian disaster relief internationally. It's very noble and should be recognized as such. My comments above should not be interpreted as to diminish that fact.

[Fixxxer]

see the analagy (or whatever it`s called) ?

Possibly.

Since America is the man in a suit that is a little dirty so that's why money isn't given to America? And since no money is given the people of America think everyone hates them?

[TaLoN]

Prime Minister Paul Martin pledged to President Bush that Canada would provide "any and all possible assistance".

People have to keep in mind however that the US has a healthy disaster/emergency infrastructure. Pouring money, people, or relief goods into the area halfhazardly isn't going to do much good. Once the situation stabilizes and it is known exactly what assistance is necessary, there is no doubt in my mind that it will be offered.

It will not be very long before I see Katrina Relief donation opportunities around here, just like any disaster before.

This kind of sentiment is a little frustrating. I remember clearly after 911 the intensive relief efforts being organized here - from fund raising to food and clothing drives to sending thousands of volunteer emergency workers and others to help out, to to mention feeding and housing the thousands and thousands of US citizens caught in the air that day. What do we get for our efforts? More or less accused of turning our backs on you.

Just because Fox News or CNN doesn't emphasize international support efforts doesn't mean they aren't there.

Just an a counterpoint, I admit that the US does a tremendous amount of humanitarian disaster relief internationally. It's very noble and should be recognized as such. My comments above should not be interpreted as to diminish that fact.

Couldnt agree more.

[Mutt_Dog]

Well i've heard that France, Romania, Germany, the United Kingdom have offered condolences and Germany offer to help and i think Romania as well if i heard GMA right...Romania had some huge floods a month or so ago and they are eager to help...

[DaSmerg]

Since we've got this thread going and this is more the political discussion arena and I didn't want to de-rail the chit-chat thread...

A pretty intersting point raised when I was watching Hardball's coverage last night on the relief efforts.  

Wouldn't and shouldn't this be a test for the pretty massive amounts of money that has been pouring into various Homeland Security agencies over the last few years?  Yes, not exactly a disaster like a large bomb or nuclear or bio hazard, but still.  A widely affected area.  Hundreds, possibley thousands killed.  Hundreds of thousands of people displaced.  A massive clean up zone.  Bascially the common denomonators of what is a homeland crisis situation.

[Da Fish]

Since we've got this thread going and this is more the political discussion arena and I didn't want to de-rail the chit-chat thread...

A pretty intersting point raised when I was watching Hardball's coverage last night on the relief efforts.  

Wouldn't and shouldn't this be a test for the pretty massive amounts of money that has been pouring into various Homeland Security agencies over the last few years?   but still.  A widely affected area.  Hundreds, possibley thousands killed.  Hundreds of thousands of people displaced.  A massive clean up zone.  Bascially the common denomonators of what is a homeland crisis situation.

Yes, not exactly a disaster like a large bomb or nuclear or bio hazard,

You see the water, in the flood plain, with all the rubbish, toilet waste and corpses. If that doesnt consitute a bio-hazard, (thinking Cholera, Diptheria etc etc) I dont know what does.

[note:]possibly taken out of context!

[BajaBravo]

"Whenever there is a need ... they have but to ask and we in the Canadian Forces will have it rolling or sailing or flying southward as quickly as possible" - Chief of the Defence Staff General Rick Hillier

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20050901.wkatrinaaid0901/BNStory/National/

[MONOLITH]

Smerg, first off...Howdy. *waves*.  :smile:

In total seriousness to your comment though, and I swear this isn't a 'lure', Isn't the Homeland Security and it's coffers dedicated to the prevention of foriegn sneak attacks, and not the clean up afterwards, should one get through? At least in it's 'first and foremost' responsibility?

I think after the suitcase nuke goes off, it's turned over to FEMA and the other similar organizations to deal with.

I could be wrong, but I thought that was the intent of the Homeland Security and it's funds. I just want to make sure we're pointing fingers at the right thing.

[MONOLITH]

Secondly, just wanted to ad that my first response to this thread was meant in a very generalized sense. I have no doubts that our true allies would offer assistance. My comment was more really to say that the weak get the most and quickest help, the mighty are more often expected to support themselves.

I am thankful to Canada and any other country that lends aid during this crisis.

[DaSmerg]

You're right, a part of HS is to protect from the bad guys.

But, AFAIK isn't the larger part of Homeland Security disaster response and co-ordination?

I mean, wasn't that the reason to combine so many agencies under one umbrella organization...prevention and response?

I just think that it's an interesting point to be looked at.  This really is a disaster and a test of how far along disaster response has come and the HS office is supposedly to take part in this type of situation AFAIK.  Essential services are gone in a large area.  Hundreds...possibley thousands killed.  Thousands displaced for what is going to be a long period of time.  Fish points out...quite rightly...that there is a bio-hazard present as well that will only grow worse over time.

[Da Fish]

Their is also a HUUUUGE difference between planning for such events and the actual implementing of a plan. I doubt the helicopter pilots where expecting gunfire when they where breifed a few days ago.

Techinically, I'm guessing Homeland Security's main job would be to protect american citizens on american soil. They would have the responsibility in that respect, and also the infrastructure to command and control the releif effort.

lol.................... or we could just look at the website

[MONOLITH]

I asked because I honestly didn't know. I thought the HS was set up to handle the prevention, not deal with the aftermath.

But, here's the answer right from the site Da Fish just posted...

"In the event of a terrorist attack, natural disaster or other large-scale emergency, the Department of Homeland Security will assume primary responsibility on March 1st for ensuring that emergency response professionals are prepared for any situation. This will entail providing a coordinated, comprehensive federal response to any large-scale crisis and mounting a swift and effective recovery effort."

That sure says it right there. Guess you got it right Smerg. I have to say, I'm not impressed with our response to this so far. I'm sure it can be argued how difficult it is, etc etc, but....still... This is simply atrocious what is happening on our own soil several days after.

[MONOLITH]

"4:45 P.M. - (AP): In a dramatic turnabout, the United States is now on the receiving end of help from around the world as some two dozen countries offer post-hurricane assistance."

http://www.wwltv.com/local/stories/wwl090105usgetshelp.16cbe69d.html

[MONOLITH]

Ya know... I voted for this guy...But I have to say, this is a really moronic thing for the President of the United States of America to say...


Still, Bush told ABC-TV: "I'm not expecting much from foreign nations because we hadn't asked for it. I do expect a lot of sympathy and perhaps some will send cash dollars. But this country's going to rise up and take care of it."


"You know," he said, "we would love help, but we're going to take care of our own business as well, and there's no doubt in my mind we'll succeed. And there's no doubt in my mind, as I sit here talking to you, that New Orleans is going to rise up again as a great city."

Oh man. I'm embarrassed.

[MONOLITH]

"However, in Moscow, a Russian official said the U.S. Federal Emergency Management Agency had rejected a Russian offer to dispatch rescue teams and other aid."

Idiots. Gawd. Where does the arrogance end?

[Reeper]

You have to remember though, there are a lot of idiots down there right now shooting at people who are trying to help, how would Russian S&R forces getting shot or killed go over in Russia ... its sad to say but the people down their who are shooting at officers are damning themselves and thousands of other people with their actions.

[MONOLITH]

Probably a valid point.

I just wish when these statements are made, or reported, that the entire context or reasoning would also be stated;

IE.."It's too dangerous for russian rescue teams right now".

The truth would set us all free. But most likely, to save themselves the embarrassment of admitting to Russia that we do not have it under control, russia was not told it that way.

I wish we could all just get along.

Oh my gawd! I've turned Liberal!  :tongue:

[SilentEdge]

If liberalism is a mental disorder... It must be infectious... I agree.

[MaJix]

a step in the right direction, shouldnt let labels blind you of your own opinions

[SilentEdge]

a step in the right direction, shouldnt let labels blind you of your own opinions

We need a sarcasm face...

I was totally not serious. There's nothing "liberal" about swallowing your pride and doing the right thing now and then. I think if America accepted help it would bolster international relations.

We condemn the Russians for not requesting assistance with a piece of top military hardward (Kursk), but we can't allow a couple commrades to come down and clean out a street? That's BS.