The rising threat of Mother Russia

[alphamikepapa]

if you read "mine comph" he stated that his intention was to restore germany to it's pre treaty of versille glory, deliver it from poverty, and build germanies ability to defend itself.

I dont see how sending his people back into the 1970s communist style dictatorship is good intentions though.

[MONOLITH]

if you read "mine comph" .

I'm not completely unfamiliar with Mein Kampf.

In it, long before WW2, he was already calling for the eradication of Jews. He called for the destruction of both communism (russia) and judaism.

He even mentions gassing the jews in Mein Kampf, long before his rise to power and the events of WW2.

Mein Kampf was a foreshadowing of his unspeakably evil intentions, much more than just improving Germany.

"At the beginning of the [First World] War, or even during the War, if twelve or fifteen thousand of these Jews who were corrupting the nation had been forced to submit to poison-gas . . . then the millions of sacrifices made at the front would not have been in vain."
~(Mein Kampf, vol. 2, chap. 15: "The Right to Self-Defence")

[MONOLITH]

I'm going to bow out of this one.

Touting the 'intelligence and good intentions' of Hitler during Hanukkah is probably a really bad idea.

Moving on to another thread.....

[farmboy]

^^agreed

[MONOLITH]

Wow....check this out. Getting back to the Putin topic...seems I was right.

"Putin's liberal economic adviser resigns, saying Russia 'not free'

Just last week, in what may have been his last major press conference as adviser, he said: "Russia has ceased being a free and democratic country."

http://www.breitbart.com/news/2005/12/27/051227130907.obcu6uet.html





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[alphamikepapa]

it'll be interesting to see if Europe/Asia has a big reaction to this and all the rest of what is happening.

[Dr.Jeckyl]

it'll be interesting to see what Bush has to say about this.

[alphamikepapa]

well it's pretty obvious, it prolly wont take too much more and I'm sure the weels will start turning.

[MONOLITH]

Bush and Rice (on her Eurasia tour about the secret prisons) both have made public statements about Russia's slow step backwards into dictatorship.

[alphamikepapa]

doesnt suprise me, it'll start with the economic stuff (trade emargos and such). the thing is what do we do past that. I dont think it'll go in front of the security council for millitary action. But anything is possible.

[Aramis]

Bush will make some broad generalizations on leadership and dictatorship, condemning such goverments as not holding the will of the people first, blah blah blah.

Bottom line is that he can't really invest himself (or the US) too much into any actions against Putin as the military is spread very thin. We've got our fingers in so many pies that there's no way we're going to go for more.

Putin is an interesting guy; I don't think you can compare him to Hitler at all really- as Mono's quote from Mein Kampf shows, Hitler was completely obsessed with wiping out an entire race of people, and let that obsession spread to creating a master race. Putin is merely a politician making a grab at power that the USSR once held and rattling what sabers he has available to him. That's not to say he shouldn't be watched; but I think he's more bravado than anything else. There are bigger issues in Korea or Iraq or South Africa than that.

[Dr.Jeckyl]

i wasn't comparing him to Hitler in that kind of way. i was comparing MONO's interest in Putin to my interest in Hitler, as a person and not respectful in any way. because the guy was a VERY interesting subject at the same time a VERY evil person who should have been shot way long before he did die.

[Jamo]

Yes i think you are all getting ahead of yourselves. I cant see this going any further than Bush making some sort of speech supposedly not pointing directly at Russia about dictatorship etc. Then, nothing will change on Russias side and you will not here anything from either side again.
If anything I think Europe will make the first moves.

[SilentEdge]

Russia is more Ripe for Socialist takeover today then it ever was before.

As Marx would say though "You don't Socialize poverty."

[Fixxxer]

Not sure if this fits in to the rebuilding of Mother Russia, but Ukraine has had it's natural gas supply from Russia cut off.

Though Russia says it is purely a business dispute, the row has fed concern that the Kremlin is prepared to use its vast energy resources as a political weapon.

Ukraine's Western-leaning president, Viktor Yushchenko, has irked Moscow by trying to take his ex-Soviet state on Russia's western border into NATO and the European Union.

Ukrainian officials say that is why the Kremlin is punishing Ukraine with such a huge price increase while letting more Moscow-friendly ex-Soviet states such as Belarus pay far less.

Source

[MONOLITH]

It certainly does fit. Another example of Putin tightening his iron fist, in a bad way.

[Da Fish]

lol @ "buisness dispute" with neighbouring countries..........

You know you should worry when part of russias Parliament owns the rights to the the oil and gas found in Siberia and they start waving it around as some sort economic tool.

Having said that, looking through the political history of Putin and his associates I  dont doubt the fact there are a few ex KGB who are best pals with mr Putin.

[Jamo]

From reading through this though. I must say, Putin sounds like a very clever man.

[alphamikepapa]

they're slipping back into a socialist style economic/trade system.thats how they lost before.

[DaSmerg]

I don't know if it's been linked or quoted in this discussion regarding the Ukraine gas dispute...

This is part political power play...part business.

The Ukraine is paying a preferred rate for natural gas.  This rate is extended to those who opt into help paying for (or actually participating) in a fund that helps pay for the defence of the natural gas pipeline in the less tame parts of the world where it runs through...like Belarus to name one.

The Ukraine has opted out of paying into a pool defence fund for the pipeline.  Russia has said since it is neither paying for the defence nor participating in the physical defence of the pipeline, the Ukraine must therefore pay normal full rates for the natural gas it receives from the pipeline.  

The Ukraine has so far refused to do such a thing and has been only paying the reduced rate.

Well, it came to a loggerheads and the Russkies cut off the gas supply for a short time to turn up the bargaining heat.

Interesting stuff.